Patty Miller – Episode 2 When Parents Disagree


Understanding Humans with Patty Miller

Patty Miller, President and Sr. HR Consultant at MillerNet HR Solutions, is a very gifted and experienced leadership and life coach, Patty has been helping people better themselves with the human assessment tool, the Core Values Index, for over 7 years. With over 17 years of Human Resources experience, Patty helps people understand themselves so that they can understand their natural conflict strategies and through awareness know the best time to take a stand or stand down.

In Patty’s Understanding Humans Series, we take her skills to a new level. While understanding yourself and your natural tendencies can be used to help you find the best sustainable career, we have found that it can also be used to understand other people and what their natural tendencies are.


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This can help autism families in many ways. The most obvious is a logical and structured way to help people that have trouble understanding social cues to recognize the natural tendencies of others so that they can better understand the reactions of others.





In episode two, Patty works with Autism Today Foundation Founder Vincent dela Luna and his wife Chix to show us that if we can learn to recognize the innate natures of others, we can understand the natural ways they are likely to deal with conflicts. With that awareness, there is a greater understanding, greater patience and fewer arguments.

Take a look at how Patty uses the Core Values Index and how it might help you and the ones you love have a better understanding of each other. And if you want to talk to Patty directly to help understand others or to help you directly with your career, visit MillerNet HR Solutions at

And stay tuned as Patty continues her series to show how Understanding Humans doesn’t have to be as hard as it sounds. Keep up the great work, Patty!




Understanding Humans with Patty Miller
Episode 2: When Parents Disagree

Tue, Apr 26,2022 1:43AM • 46:29


vince, cvi, knowledge, people, thinking, energy, wisdom, love, higher, emoting, situation, buy, work, feel, leader, emotion, mind, trust, understand, happened


Vincent DelaLuna, Chix dela Luna, Patty Miller‍

Patty Miller  00:00

Hi. I am thrilled to be talking today with, with Chix and with Vincent. And and I know Vincent that you are part of Autism Today. And a big reason why you are with Autism Today is you are two proud parents of two amazing children that happened to have autism. And and I know that you have two children and one is more severe, as it’s called, versus the other and that you are looking for tools and techniques to help you navigate the the sometimes the landmines or the not so big of landmines to have harmony, and love and inclusion in your home. And I believe once we go through Core Values Index and describe the various energies, you’re going to understand each other better, you’re going to know how you can you know that that’s the goal of our of our conversation today is have tools and techniques to be able to understand each other, to help each other to look at each other and go I get you, you get me and now you’re parenting as a united front versus on an individual. And then sometimes when you are in when you’re individually parenting together, then that causes conflicts within the team, the family unit is as parents, and it’s hard enough as it is life is hard enough as it is raising children is hard enough as it is. And if you can have as much information to help you navigate through these difficult times and know who you are. And we’re all growing until we’re six feet under. And this would be a really wonderful tool for you both. So thank you for letting me have the chance to do this.

Vincent Dela Luna  01:55

Thank you for inviting us.

Patty Miller  01:57

Firstly, what the core values energies are a definition of all of the four energies. Vince, I know I did that with you once but for Chix’s benefit I want to make sure that she has everything is well. And I’m also going to want to really kind of focus on the differences between the two of you. And and help you understand because however you are Chix, you’re not right or wrong. And Vince, you’re not right or wrong. But when you can be mindfully aware of how each other comes to a situation based on how you are wired your basically your innate unchanging ways, then that will help you understand each other. And it’ll help you understand life. And it’ll help you understand the dynamics within your family. So I’m thrilled and honored to be able to do this with you. So I wanted to show firstly, Chix’s profile. And I have to underscore that nobody has ever in in the whole million plus people globally that have ever taken this assessment, no one has ever been a perfect square, which means 161616 and 16. And we’ve had some people close where maybe it was 14 and 17. But we’ve never had anybody be a perfect square. Sometimes one would think, well, it’s awesome to be a perfect square, because then you have all of the energies to work with. And there are that that is a pro of having all of those energies. On the flip side because everything is so act are so equal in a sense, you don’t know which personality or which one of you need to bring forward. And what I mean by personality, it’s not like you’re splitting your personalities is which energy do you bring forward into the into the room that is most needed at that moment.

Patty Miller  03:43

So for Chix, 57% of your energy is coming from love and wisdom. So love, wisdom, knowledge and power. So you, you fall into a good 75% of the population where we’re either love wisdom, or wisdom power. And myself, I am love wisdom, power knowledge. So you think it’s just a simple square, but it really is based on the numbers and I’m going to go over your specific numbers and compare the two of yours. And then we’re going to work on how that’s going to gel collectively. So, I wanted to show you your profile and then this is Vincent’s. So, ironically 57% of his energy is coming from wisdom and knowledge. So he is more bottom heavy as I call it, but and I will explain that as well. So he is certainly living in the energy of wisdom which is assess, sorry, not assessing solve it is assessing solve it is assessment of solutions, and figuring out how to come to a conclusion with the least amount of hiccups as you have for that as well. Chix as well. So 57% of your energy so you’re waking up ours are you’re oscillating within fleeting seconds moments, milliseconds, between your wisdom and your power. Now I’m going to go to you Chix and wanted to share ironically, your 57% of your waking energy is love and wisdom. So Vince, you’re living in the wisdom mind. And while you have tappable energy Chix in in wisdom, you are living first in your love mind. So right there is a disconnect between the two of you.

Patty Miller  05:31

So now I’m going to describe your differences. So this is an example, someone when you’re when you’re over 24, in, in numbers, these numbers mean a lot. And when you’re over 24, then that means you are profound, meaning that this particular example, it has two accessible energies, but love is the is the highest energy, and it is their, their primal energy that they work in. And so people that are profound in that it’s not a bad thing, it’s just something to be more mindful of, because it’s, it’s the place you want to land all the time. It’s your comfort zone. And we have more growth, when we can stretch our comfort zone. A comfort zone is not like a balloon that you blow up. And then when it deflates, it goes back pretty much to the same size. A comfort zone is something when you can stretch, that’s now your new normal. When you stretch your comfort zone again, that’s your new normal. So the more you can expand your comfort zone that the better that is for you. So this is an example of a graph of as I mentioned, profound, this is someone not so much for you, Vince, but I call this bottom heavy. And some of the wired and life challenges for someone that has their energy in wisdom and knowledge is they can go and go into knowledge. And they assess and solve the Rubik’s Cubing and thinking of all the data, and then they go into their mind in their head. And they’ve now doing their knowledge, the conservation of data, they’re putting it on Excel spreadsheets, they’re seeing patterns, they’re they’re doing their homework, and then they go hmm, I’m going to do a little bit more research. And they go into wisdom, and they gather more data. And then they go into knowledge. And my point is, is you can get into what’s called analysis paralysis.

Patty Miller  07:13

So you might have a lot of balls in the air, a lot of activities going, you’re spinning a lot of plates, but you’re not necessarily concluding all of those actions. And I’ve also seen this on that autistic spectrum as well, we’re or ADD individuals where they may, they can’t complete things or they, they might hoard a little bit of like they I’ll keep this magazine for later because I want to get to it. And then next thing, you know, their magazine piles are this high, because they haven’t gotten to it. So I’m being extreme in some of my examples, because I want to show you how this can define and help you understand who you are. And then as I mentioned earlier, this is purely intuitive, you know, when you’re going into power, making, you know, taking risk, a power person has no problem taking risks. Sure, let’s go bungee jumping, where knowledge person is gonna go. I might go jump bungee jumping, how old is that bungee? How accurate is your scale? How long have you been working here? Like they’re not going to take the risk, right? So power person is going to take the risk and a knowledge person is going to be very conservative. So you know, they are more overt and overt in conflict. So you’re going mostly, you know, mostly intuitive, when actually when you add these two energies up, this is intuition. You add these two energies up that is your creative, these two energies at the bottom, that is your cognitive. And these two is your practical. And then also when I go side by side, so this is you, Vince.  You are what’s called independent. So you’re thinking and then you’re taking action. And this is where Chix you might be going Chix, I apologize. You might be going, Vince, why don’t you not come talk to me? Or we want it I want to talk about this a little bit more. And you’re already making a decision and you’re feeling perhaps a little bit unheard. And and what you know, and that your voice isn’t making the difference and that you haven’t collaborated as comfortably as you would like in that experience. Does that make sense? Do you feel that that might happen?

Chix dela Luna  09:20

In some cases? Yes.

Patty Miller  09:23

So I want to talk about each of your energies. So for you, Vince at at wisdom at 26. And for you Chix at 19. For every three points, we call that a degree of magnitude. So it’s like a point three on the Richter scale or a point six, you don’t really feel it at a point three, you have to you feel it more point six. You definitely feel it more at a point nine. So between the two of you right there, you’ve got seven points of difference. So just over two degrees of magnitude. So for you Chix, recognize that this is where Vince likes to live is in that assess and solve in always in his head a little bit more, and for him to come to love, His love is 13. And your love is 22. So that does not mean that Vince isn’t lovable in any way, shape or form. But he is just not, he’s not being pulled into the emotion of your autistic children when they are having their episodes. So he’s more even remember, compassion is the catalytic value. So he’s not going to that higher, higher, elevated emotion or lower elevated emotion, whereas I know I would.

Patty Miller  10:37

And I give an example of my two, my two sons, I have two sons, Kyle and Eric and Kyle who’s older, he still lets me kiss him up. My younger son Eric doesn’t really like that. And I was thinking because I’m, he’s not love. And he was saying when he was like, 15 14, like, please don’t kiss me goodnight.  I would come into his room and kiss him goodnight.  He said don’t. He just felt that that was an invasion of his privacy. And I’m like, Well, I’m Mom, I want to kiss you what the heck?  I’m Mom, I’m gonna kiss you. And I had to actually stop the I had to, I had to work this through me. Firstly, I have to respect him as a human, even though he’s younger than me, and he’s my son. He has an opinion, I need to respect his opinion, I can’t force myself on him, you’re going to get a kiss, and you’re going to be loved, whether you like it or not, he didn’t want that. So I you know, doesn’t mean he doesn’t love me, and I don’t love him. But he just didn’t want me to kiss him. Goodnight. So my point is, is that hurt me. And so that might hurt you Chix is when may be someone is not. And you need to recognize then that that if someone is emoting and they’re more knowledge, then they’re not going to give us love people what we want. And that’s where it’ll help be helpful for you to go into what’s needed here. Do I need power? Or do I need wisdom? Or do I need knowledge because remember, you’re tappable and all of them. For both of you, you’re tappable in all four of your energies, but you just need to be more mindfully aware of that. So, so for love is that’s how you come into the room, you want to like how can I make everybody comfortable, you’re hungry, you know, that’s what I saw people do. Whereas Vince might be going, I got some work to do, I got to get things going. Or you might be even more, more cognitive and linear in your thinking of how to deflect and defuse a situation, and you’re not being emotionally pulled in Vince. So because I’m aware that you know, you have two autistic amazing children, and that Vince seems to have a better connection andin being able to de-escalate an escalated situation. And so for you, Chix, Chix, it’d be more helpful if you work more into your wisdom and leave your emotions out of it. And that’s hard, because you know, you care. But you just have to go What, what’s needed right now and what I find is helpful. Instead of going which needed jointed live wisdom, power knowledge, I actually go to the, the, the catalytic value, and I go what’s needed right now faith? So I just need to take action, like and make things happen? Or is truth part of the equation? What needs to be done? Or do I have compassionate? Or is this fair, and just, and so I find by actually thinking, what needs to be done right now, that’s how I can be a better Pro, human, family member, wife, friend, you know, those are things that that matter to me.

Patty Miller  13:33

So interesting, you both have tappable knowledge. So for you, Vince, your knowledge is at 20. And so, between 25 and19 on the ladder, it is you ordinarily and regularly operate in line with these core values, and you find it energizing. So it’s a fun place to be, you know, people that have that those types of numbers between 25 and 19. So your knowledge finishes at 19 and, sorry, at 20. But your knowledge, Chix is 18. So you’re at the you are between 18 and 12, you occasionally and with effort operate in line with these core values. So what I mean by that is, it’s tappable, but we’re going down by numbers, if you were 12 it would be harder for you to get into your knowledge. So my knowledge is 12. So that that doesn’t mean I don’t know a lot I know a lot I’m smart. However, when it comes into the, the data the put me on Excel spreadsheets and that so I like to be for me. I like to read oil and gas magazine, you know, being a proud Albertan with our amazing energy. I like to stay on top of what’s what’s happening, but it’s dry. And it’s technical. I don’t mind technical, but it’s dry, and I have to psych myself up and go, Okay, Patty, I better read this and I can feel myself maybe an hour into the you know, into the read that I’m losing my own attention span. And I have to put it down, and I have to come back to it. So that’s an example of knowledge where, for those that are lighter in knowledge, that would be an example of it’s, it’s only in you to give in short bursts. And if you are under11, and if let’s say you’re at five or seven, that’s an energy, that’s not even tappable. So it’s not in you to give, so don’t even worry about it. Don’t work on that for yourself, just that that’s okay. Right, so you’re never going to catch me being an accountant. But when it comes to, you know, highly charged emotional situations in human resources, or in business or in life, life coaching, I step up, and that’s where I rise to my strengths. And so I just needed to just kind of talk a little bit about the differences that way.

Patty Miller  15:44

So your power is at 14 Chix, and Vince you’r eat 17. So you’re one degree of magnitude. So you’re both have good power. But remember, at 17, you’re on the higher you occasionally operate. And at 14, it’s a little less for you. So taking action, that’s where your love might sabotage you a little bit and go, You know what, quit thinking about it, let’s just poop or get off the pot, let’s just take action, I think that will be better for the family. And that’s where you would actually have a little bit more cohesion and things where you would just go, You know what, let’s just there’s just let it go. Where the two of you can fortify each other. And this is what my husband and I do. It’s not like you want to be like each other actually, the more differences you have, the better you help each other out. So my husband, he likes he’s wisdom, knowledge. And we have friends, I think I may have shared this with you Vince offline before but we have friends and they make me laugh. They they have such trust in Greg, that’s my husband in his in his decision making and his research and his knowledge that when they say, What TV Did you buy? What camera did you buy? What computer Did you buy? What did you buy? He goes this brand, and they go on to buy the exact one and he say, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, don’t you need to do your homework? And he’s like, they’re going no, we trust you. You’ve already done it, why should we waste our time? So So my point is, is there’s there’s a handshake, I don’t like you know, my, my husband, he’s certainly helps me more with my IT situations because he likes that, where as that devalue? It just is not an energy, I want to spend time in so we help each other be better because of that. And then so if you have someone who’s high in knowledge, and later on the love, someone who’s more in the love can actually help fortify that knowledge person and together they’re like Batman and Robin or Burt and Ernie or Superman and Wonder Woman right, you know, you’re you’re a better team because of that. And so, so for you Chix, you may have felt that Vince may not have valued you or or heard you. And Vince, you may sometimes go, well I know what to do. It’s so obvious. Why, why are we talking about this, let’s just move let’s just do it. It’s so obvious. And so and you’re feeling unheard. And so this is where this because your love is different. And love is probably one of the more main energies for us humans, because at love for you, Vince at 13 and love for you at 22, we’re at nine, nine points of difference. So three degrees of magnitude.

Patty Miller  18:15

So, Vince, you will, you will have higher understanding if you can raise your love up, and you will have higher understanding if you could suppress your emotions. Remember what has left people due to a fault? We have that fairness factor? Why would you do that, tome, I can’t believe that. And also count, when we give too many chances. That is a big one for us love people, we give too many chances. So be mindful when we go when we’re giving you know our friend 10 chances too many, right? That’s where truth and trust is no longer part of the equation. And we need to call it faster. So as love people tend to be taken advantage of more. So I don’t like to be taken advantage of. So catch that. And again, the emotional language that’s being used love people use that. But catch the how many chances we give and start to go is this truth is this trust. Now you’re going into wisdom by thinking is this truth is this trust, and then you can make your decisions. So it’s nice to go back into wisdom on that one.

Vincent Dela Luna  19:22

Amazing how accurate it is. It’s really…

Patty Miller  19:25

It’s crazy.

Vincent Dela Luna  19:26

I can recall while you’re talking, I really, I felt three kinds of scenarios that just define precisely what you said. Right. The first one is, you know, we’ve got the two autistic children.

Vincent Dela Luna  19:38

One is severe. So when she has a meltdown or a breakdown, and immediately Chix is I can’t Yeah, she’s in distress because I can’t listen to this crying. I got to deal with it. And it’s all about the child’s feelings and what they’re feeling. And for me, it’s like that immediately. It’s not that I don’t care what they’re feeling. It’s a I look a tit as like, Well, why is this happening? What just happened? What is the reason Solve the reason.

Patty Miller  19:38


Patty Miller  20:10

And what needs to be done?

Vincent Dela Luna  20:11

Yeah. Forget about the feeling for a second, let’s backtrack. What happened? What are the three steps that happened before this so that we can see what changed? Let’s resolve that issue and it’ll stop, you know, whereas sometimes she might be so involved in the feeling that there’s no solution happening. It just, it’s like Band Aid Band Aid band, a band aid Band Aid, whereas I’m like, Oh, well, let’s just stop the bleeding first, you know, so we approach it differently. Then there’s the aspects of, for example, when she’s when she’s at work, and she’s like, you know, these people at work said this, and my boss talked to me like this. And, and for me, it’s immediately. It’s not that I don’t care how she feels. But when she’s talking to me, I’m not thinking about the feeling relationship of what just happened emotionally. I’m just like, oh, well, maybe he’s trying to get her fired. Maybe all of a sudden, there’s this strategy structure things. I think it’s a power play. It sounds like a powerplay. You know, I break it down right away, and I see it in a different logical sense, you know.

Chix dela Luna  21:14

And I disagree.

Vincent Dela Luna  21:15

Right. And then and then. And then there’s the other aspect of, like, very simply, we’re driving to a drive in a drive thru, right? And what drives me nuts all the time is, if we know we’re going 20minutes ago, I’ve already in my mind figured out okay, well, we’re probably going to get this and I’ll get this. And I can ask her 17 times. So what do you want to get? What do you want to get? Even when I’m there? She’s like, I don’t know, what do I get? And she’s not sure what to have. There’s like, no preparation. I’m like, we’ve been here 3 million times. You know, but it’s this whole, you know, what do I feel like? I don’t think…

Chix dela Luna  21:16

I’m thinking of something else.

Vincent Dela Luna  21:36

So, I always just like, I always go there knowing I’m gonna buy her two or three meals. I just just to get it over with…

Patty Miller  21:58

Hahaha, bring it home. Yeah.

Vincent Dela Luna  22:00

Three favorite ones. I’m just gonna get all of them. I get home, it’s like… choose what you’d like to have.

Patty Miller  22:05

So what that is, ironically, Chix, that is your, your knowledge talking? And you might think well, really, is that my knowledge is because you are now going into your head. And you are thinking what gives me the most pleasure? If I have this hamburger? Do I want it you know, is am I going to get the most enjoyment out of eating a hamburger? Or do I want this chicken with this really yummy sauce. And if I want this, this one’s $5 more and am I going to get more value out of eating this for $5 more. So I, that reminds me, I love what you’re saying. That reminds me of a story when my son was younger, who, you know, you hear doctors where they say they don’t have good bedside manner. That means a doctor has fantastic and knowledge and wisdom. But they don’t have that social emotional intelligence in the love. But make no mistake, they’re rock stars in their technical knowledge of the medical, of their, of their, of their, of their world. They dominate. And then the ones that have more bedside manner. They’re the ones that have more compassion, and they, it’s in them to give the emotion. But I’m bringing up my son Kyle, because when he was a little guy, and I gave him $3. And we would go to a candy store, if you remember those, those gaming places where you know, you you put in a quarter play the game, you get so many tickets, and then you get those tickets to redeem… Ha, I hated those places. It would take them half an hour, he would think is that rubber ball gonna give me more enjoyment than this and that and he and I’m like, hurry, hurry, hurry, and then that would get him all going Hurry, hurry, hurry. And he’s like, I’m not I’m not ready. Hurry, hurry, hurry, because I’m thinking about me. And I’m not. I’m not empathizing with how he’s wired and what he needs for a decision.

Patty Miller  23:47

And so it’s just interesting. If you start to go, it’s not about me. It’s not about you, you’re not wrong, you’re not wrong, but it’s like, what are we going to do collectively? So you’re right, Vince, you’re that you’re not even emotionally involved? And where as you are Chix? And you might be and you might be thinking, that’s because she’s female has nothing to do with that. It is because she’s higher in love at 22. And for you. You might think it’s just a male thing. It is not it at all. It is a fact that that that she is just she she’s feeling the trust and or lack thereof, and how many times people are taking advantage of her good nature and, and why they may treat her. You know, like she’s got that sense of fairness, right? So be mindful of that. So So do you have any situations that you may want to share that? That maybe Chix when does it work for you when you’re maybe trying to address a situation what works for you and perhaps what does not?

Chix dela Luna  24:50

Right off the bat when I can think is a work situation. I’ve been a manager and I lead a team of analysts What I love about my work is that I get to mentor them and lead them and guide them and whatnot. And I know I’m a great leader because I, I forget what it’s called. But I’m an inspired leader where I do inspire. And because then I get to know them on a personal level. So that I know the team loves me in my, I think everywhere I’ve gone in, my boss would always tell me Chix you’re too nice. Right? And, and I’ve always thought, Well, I’m nice, but then I get, I get to ask them what I want them to do. And they do it. They’ll do it for me, because they like me, they love me as a manager and whatnot. But I also sometimes get in trouble, because I’m too nice. And I don’t know if maybe to the extent of people are, especially in politics.  Sorry, not in politics, politics in the office, that’s where it’s, it’s not good for me, because like what he says, it really impacts me or affects me a lot. Because I refuse to believe that, how can this person do this to me? Or no, they’re not thinking that way? You know, or Where’s this coming from? I always ask the question in my head, why is this person like this? Where are they coming from? What happened to them? Just so I can understand, you know, I come from a place where, okay, let me understand where you’re coming from. But when it comes to office politics, you know, somebody’s like, a peer because I’m a manager, or I’m a lead. So I have to work with peers, who are strong personalities, I would say, and they’re bullies. And that’s where I have trouble it, I find myself getting upset. And when I get upset, it really, I didn’t like that I got upset.

Patty Miller  26:49

then you go into relation?

Chix dela Luna  26:51

Yes. Yeah. So that’s all okay. And then when I do get upset, that’s where it’s really bad when I get upset, because I, it’s almost like I’m stopping myself yelling at them. But then people will say, That’s not you. So that’s where I kind of have to, I guess, lean more on my knowledge, just remain in the facts. And you know, just I guess, attack it from there. I don’t know, that’s, that’s where I’m still learning.

Patty Miller  27:23

Thank you for that share. I’ll give you an example. Because I think it resonates with your example, I was working with this global insurance company and the one leader, there was a bit of a coup, where a bunch of her reports, all within one week, five complaints were put towards her, right. And so all that it was it was a bit of a coup, but they were and she was very high in love. And their HR manager was very low in love and was wisdom knowledge. So she took everything that came at her with those complaints at face value. And she didn’t do an investigation, she took it as at face value and put the manager without even getting her side of the story on a performance improvement plan. So for that, that manager that eroded all the trust…

Chix dela Luna  28:17

I can imagine that

Patty Miller  28:19

and I’m saying so I had to coach the HR manager and say, you you know, you need to elevate your love your your curiosity, what’s happening, give me the facts, the date, you know, like, help me understand but you know, and and, and so she needed to lighten that up. And so they actually cried together when they when they found their way back to each other. But she had that heightened sense of why would they fit, you know, do that to me, and you made that comment as well. Chix where you know, why would they say that. And I’m not saying that’s a bad thing. Because, you know, like with crucial conversations you want to give, you know, for the most part, us humans don’t wake up and going, let’s go to work and do a terrible job.

Patty Miller  29:02

For the most part, people show up and they want to do good and they want you know, they don’t, now 99.9% Of the people want todo a good job. So I like how you’re giving your empathy. But catch that faster, where your empathy is too much. Right? And going to where they say you’re too nice, as a leader where I like to gently challenge leaders. What do you want more? Do you want to be respected? Or do you want to be liked? And so it’s, it’s you know, like, so you want to have you know, your coach in private, and you praise in public and if someone needs to be taken offline and where you need to, you know, help them help you understand where they’re coming from, then you take them offline in private, and you learn from that, learn from them. And then that way you have the data to now make decisions as a leader.

Vincent Dela Luna  29:53

It’s amazing when you when you look at these examples in the light of CVI, because I’ve always thought, you know, in my mind, but I never compete. I didn’t realize I was comparing myself to her. I was always like, Wow, I’ve never met anybody that just loves everybody that she just trusts everybody and loves everybody. But she never sees the bullet coming. You know, she never sees the ball coming right to her face. And like ,oh, that’s that there’s something coming. And she’s like, No, it’s not they’ll never do that. And like it’s coming. Is this like, they’re setting this up? It’s not coming, All of a sudden, she gets blindsided instead, what happened? And I’m like, Well, you know, she’s, she’s so into the emotional aspect. And but then when also she’s describing how she’s an inspiring leader. And she’s always been in a management role. And people follow her because they liked her. It’s funny when she was saying that, because I’m generally in a leadership role in the management role. And I’ve got a strong loyalty of followers, but they don’t follow me because they like me. For me, it’s like, okay, Patty, I’ll spend 20-40 minutes explaining the situation, so that you understand the logic of why you need to do what I’m asking you to do. Right?

Patty Miller  31:01


Vincent Dela Luna  31:01

I don’t, I would never ask you, can you, you know, do it ’cause you’re like me, I would never expect that. I’m like, Listen, this is why we need to do this, because this is gonna affect this person is I spell it out, you know, completely. And then. While every while I believe the people that work for me and are loyal to me like me, it’s not because of a liking as much as I think, in a logical sense, in a preparation sense that will tomorrow’s you know, Patty’s daughter’s birthday? You know, I’m going to make sure she goes home. I treat them I treat the situation and logical. What can I do? What does Patty want in life? You know, do you want to play baseball, once you go just leave work, don’t even tell anyone go play your baseball game and come back after we’ll finish afterwards. You know, I, I create a loyalty and an inspiration kind of thing in a very different way. You know, I don’t, I don’t I honestly don’t think a lot of people just like me to like me, you know, but they’re very loyal, because I take care of them in in the way that I think they want, that they want to have a life and they want to do this. And you know, but I’ve always thought, wow, she’s, I’ve never , she’s always she loves everybody. I mean, in the sense of she trusts everybody. And I can see like, I wouldn’t trust that guy, I will try. And then you know, something happens. And she’s like, Oh, my God, I can’t believe this happened. But it’s that it’s that whole love trust thing.

Patty Miller  32:24

And then and then for you Chix, it might even be a deeper wound, because you gave so much trust and you gave your regard, you gave them a high regard when they didn’t deserve such high regard. And then you kind of get burned a little bit, right. And so then you go What’s wrong, but there’s nothing wrong with you, I would like to gently challenge you, when it’s me and start with baby steps when it’s not such a big decision, but start making decisions more independently in you, versus you working with the team, with your fellow fellow peers that are in the same level as you as leaders, because I can tell very accurately, if I was to do a CVI for a business unit or a company. And if everybody was was love first, I would very accurately predict that there’s going to be splintering, and politics and cliques happening in short order. Because it everybody’s gonna go who likes who, who likes who right and the love. This is what they said that you know, and then it’s just gonna all come to life. So there’s a wonderful thing about knowing what the definition of love is, and the spirit of of Core Values Index. But the word and life challenge when you have too much love is sometimes we give too many chances. And that’s the biggest that is really the biggest lesson is to call it faster. And to be more, take your emotion out of it and look at the black and white. And you might even want to write on a calendar. Like if you if you’re having a conversation with a colleague, or a subordinate about a performance issue, write down so you might have a verbal and say, you know, and then go back and write it down on paper or electronically. So you can look at your black and white facts.

Chix dela Luna  34:06

I think what I’m one of the things I will takeaway from here is just being mindful of the I forget what your word was. The you’re giving out too many chances.

Patty Miller  34:19

Yes, there are too many chances and we have a heightened sense of fairness.

Chix dela Luna  34:22

So that’s one thing now with regards to Vince The only thing I think I’m I’m realizing or sorry, identifying is when to me when he sounds upset or is frustrated with something especially if there’s something that I do or did not do. He because he sounds the same as when he’s talking to somebody at Best Buy and they didn’t give him a good service. Like all these people are so are so incompetent.

Vincent Dela Luna  34:56

It’s always my tone.  I have a tone.

Chix dela Luna  34:59

It’s stupid and it’s like when he talks like that to them or about me, you know telling all this guy Best Buy, and I see the same behavior, I see the same tone, then that’s where I get a bit emotional. Sorry.

Patty Miller  35:14

Well because he took the vows with you not BestBuy.  Haha.

Vincent Dela Luna  35:18


Patty Miller  35:18

He took vows with you not not to be you know, like with Best Buy you’re his your his his his chosen one. So, so remember Vince at love at 13 Not that you’re crazy in love with not that you’re not in love crazy in love with your wife. But you’re not emoting that. And so she’s questioning. Are you loving me?  But you do, but you’re not emoting it. So it’ll be helpful for you. Because remember, love at 13 for you is is it you have to work at showing your you know, so be curious, how was your day? You know, tell me more about that. Don’t just give her the answer to her problem. She just sometimes wants to vent. And because you’re independent, remember, wisdom, power, wisdom, power, you’re very independent, you don’t need to talk to a lot of people. You don’t need to do your homework as much you’re very comfortable being you know, that’s why you’ve had such success and movies and all the things that you’ve done. Right, but but your wife will, you know, will be better to just show her some of those, emoting outwardly, that would be more helpful for her. And you know, I,

Chix dela Luna  36:25

sorry, I’m sorry. So don’t get me wrong. He’s like, rarely romantic, like he really does. And he gives me whatever. Sometimes I have to be careful on what I say that I want, because he’s gonna buy me a lot, but those, so he’s very good at that. It’s only when moments that he’s frustrated that I get like, whoa, why are you behaving like this? To me, this is like the same way I see you and you’re frustrated from other people. So it’s like, somehow I expected there’s a difference because I’m the wife, he’s, he’s gonna give me more slack or whatnot. So that’s, that’s where I’m learning to just see. Just think that, okay, he’s really just like that when he’s upset.

Vincent Dela Luna  37:01

I think it’s also in a CVI sense… See I…when she hears a tone. I’m not actually upset. I’m not mad, there’s nothing going on in my head. That is, because if… when, when I’m mad at somebody, or I’m angry at somebody at work, I actually get quieter. You know, I don’t, I’m not, I don’t yell and scream. I’m not that person. I don’t like tantrums. I’m not that kind of person. So in my mind, I’m not having a tone. But for the things that frustrate me, which I think gives her a sense of the tone is that of a simple example, right? She likes something, she goes buy something. And for me, it’s like, well, A) you did no research. Before I go to a store, I spend like two nights looking it up online and stuff, right?

Patty Miller  37:52

Oh yeah.

Vincent Dela Luna  37:53

I know all the details, I compare it to the other similar stuff, which one’s really worth it. And then B) I was like, you bought it three months ago, and you didn’t like it. And it there’s the but she’s like, oh, we need this, this is going to help us because of what’s going on with the kids. And, you know, she’s really like, Oh, we got to do this, we got to do this. I’m like, we tried this. And we talked to it with a therapist, and it didn’t work. And that was like seven years ago. And that’s why it doesn’t Why did you do it again? And then for her? It’s like, I’ve got this angry tone. But for me, it’s I think it’s because I break it down with? Well, that doesn’t make any sense. Why would you do that? If we already tried this, if you didn’t, if you didn’t read it, or I’m like, I spent the last whatever how many years talking to this therapist about this situation. But she was busy working. And because I was more of a taking care of the kids kind of role, then she didn’t have the luxury of the knowledge that I absorbed from these people. So so my thing Oh, that was not going to work. And she was like, well, can’t we just at least try. You know, but there’s just a different angle, because we’re coming from two different knowledge places.

Chix dela Luna  38:56

Telling me facts, but then him telling the facts is like, and I know I have to be aware of how I think as well it’s like, I can’t take everything he says like negatively. Because like he says that that’s the way he talks to him. Sometimes I just think, Okay, I just have to take it this way. So

Vincent Dela Luna  39:14

and actually now the way and I never put it together, but because of the way she just explained it before with regards to work. Because she’s, uh, you treat me like production assistants, and you treat me like this. Like she said, Best Buy, but she used to compare yourself to like the way you talk to your production assistants. And I say no, I would never talk to you way talk to them. But I just realized in my explanation to you, I do.  In the sense that there’s not an anger. I’m not demeaning in any way, or there’s nothing in the sense of my tone in my head. However, the way I try to get a point across is the same because I’m like, It’s not emotional. You know, there’s not a there’s not this whole lovey do vey thing. It’s like, well, this is the logic let me explain a, b, c. So yeah, I do talk to her the same way because I approach every problem, like, well, this is why I think this is a better avenue than this. Because of this, I will talk to everybody that way. Right? So to hear that to tone, you’re treating like the people at work. But my thing is, well, the only way I know to get my point across is to show you the facts.

Patty Miller  40:17

Yeah, you two are absolutely onto something. So So Vince, you are very, not very, but you are more cognitive and linear in your thinking, is it’s more black and white. Yes and no. So and remember, the catalytic value for wisdom is compassion. So you’re not emoting high or low, you’re just neutral. Right? So when when Chix when you say something, and he’s kind of monotone with no emotion in it, you think you’re kind of cold, right? And but that’s, that’s just you reading it differently. And and and so for for you Chix, you are more creative. Your your intuition and your creativity is very high. Why that’s why you’re kind of sometimes maybe seeing what sticks throwing it against the wall and see what sticks, right? And then that’s where there might be that disconnect between you because your your your in your desire to want to help and do such goodness, you want to throw it against the wall and see what sticks. And then you might feel that you’re not being valued. Or it might You might, or you’re being judged, because Vince might be being more cognitive and linear and saying, Well, that’s not going to work. That’s not gonna work. That’s not gonna work. So why do you do and you’re going well, where? Why should I even try anymore? Right? And, and, and, and if I may be so bold, in our conversation today, I know we’re being recorded, which is awesome. And I can see you laughing a lot more Chix and Vince, you’re just sort of monotone. You’re just you’re just there. You’re listening, and you’re taking everything in. And then but I could even be going well, is he listening? Are you? Are you interested in what I have to say? And so I might be reading you wrong? And that’s my problem, right? Well, it is and it isn’t. It’s both our problems, where I need to give you the benefit of the doubt because you and I have had many conversations offline. So I feel like I know you better. But you know, if I didn’t know you well, I’d be thinking, why is he so quiet? Why is he like this? You know, and not that you’re like that, but you’re not. You’re not smiling, you’re not nodding your head and things like that. And so, there’s nothing wrong with that. It’s just recognizing that, that you might need to give more to the love…

Vincent Dela Luna  42:27


Patty Miller  42:27

…of the world, since 75% of us are our love wisdom, mostly on the left side. Right?

Vincent Dela Luna  42:33

That makes, that makes great sense.

Patty Miller  42:33

So it’ll help you. Yeah, it’ll help you in business and it’ll help you in life and, and friendships, etc. When you know, when you know, pretend you care. I know you care, but show it.

Chix dela Luna  42:35

No, she he knows he doesn’t smile a lot, because he thinks he doesn’t have a nice smile.

Vincent Dela Luna  42:50

I know I’m not photogenic I don’t know how we created these kids that look great in every picture. I’m like, I don’t know where that came from it was not me.

Patty Miller  42:58

Haha. Oh, don’t be like that you guys are good looking couple. In conclusion, I have an example of two very good friends that were working at this engineering firm together. And I you know, the President wanted a CVI for everybody. And then I learned that they were friends I didn’t know, they went on a road trip. And she’s more wisdom knowledge. And the other one is more love wisdom. And they had a they had a disagreement, and the one who was higher in love was crying. And the one who was lighter in in love was was quiet. And she’s uh, you don’t even care. You’re not even showing any emotions. You know, you’re cold? Well, no, that’s just that, like, especially when we go into ourselves and to dealing with emotional situations, we go into our protect mode. And that’s always going to be you know, manipulation, interrogation, aloof judgment, all of that, right. So, so that’s where that came into being. Anyhow, when I said there’s nothing wrong, the fact that she wasn’t crying, and you were, she cares just as deeply as you do. She just presents it differently. And their friendship actually got stronger. Because, you know, she and the, you know, the love person was more the wing man when they went out socializing, and the other person was more the wing man for this. And so they just got each other better. And when you can do that, it helps.

Vincent Dela Luna  44:19

So when we got married, I organized everything. That’s what I do, right? I prep and I organize everything. And right now, in my mind, it’s like he’s a camera, okay, is the letter K? Which talking about what’s the next topic, which in my mind, I’m thinking as a producer. So it’s like when you what I learned is if you do all the work, and you don’t hire somebody to handle the wedding, and you’re you’re thinking all the problems. You’re not smiling in any photograph in the wedding.

Vincent Dela Luna  44:48

That’s, that’s totally what I learned during our wedding, because I handled everything. So whenever anybody moves, I’m looking at the waiters. I’m looking at the menu. I’m looking at the time and you realize you’re not smiling in any photo because you’re working. Right?

Patty Miller  44:48


Patty Miller  45:02

Yeah. I always say, too, and this is not this when I say this for love, this is now a different thing. This is more on myside on the spirituality side. I think what is needed more? So is it love not in the spirit of of CVI Core Values Index, but or do I need to be love right now? Or do I, when the opposite of love is not hate, it is actually fear. And so it ironically, works with CVI because faith is, you know, like confidence, right? That you’ve got enough, you know, but it’s also your fear. If you if you don’t fear if you have fear that you’re making a bad decision, then you don’t have the confidence you don’t have faith in yourself. So we want so the opposite of love is fear. And so when you’re taking action and making decisions on anything, what’s needed in the room right now, you know, am I am I responding out of fear? Or am I responding out of love? And then if you if you figure out and you know, you can think so quickly, if it’s fear based, then you can start to go what energy is needed most for this specific situation.

Chix dela Luna  46:05

Thank you so very much.

Vincent Dela Luna  46:06

Thank you very much.

Patty Miller  46:08

Pleasure, pleasure. Have a wonderful weekend. Take care


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